Is there any forgiving a NO vote the next time?

Tris over at Munquin’s New Repulic has posted a couple of blogs the last couple of days about our impending war with Spain over Gibraltar (according to the former Tory Leader Michael Howard) due to the EU giving Spain a veto over any trade deal as a result of the dispute with Great Britain over Gibraltar and the horrific near murder of a teenage boy in London whose crime was to not be English, and I assume white.

I remember when a veto was a good thing, a funny thing, a thing the British loved,

In fairness to the UK, and the people who live in Gibraltar, the EU are wrong to give Spain a veto over the rock as Spain were wrong to threaten to veto an independent Scotland joining the EU in my opinion, but what goes around comes around as they say given that Spain is now saying it won’t veto an independent Scotland joining the EU.

Also slipping under the radar were these two gems:

What a truly disgusting country we live in, as some work up the natives with hate towards refugees and asylum seekers and to Spain, to the point they are ready to go to war with one of our closest allies, when they beat a poor boy near to death who came to this country for protection the Government sneek out another wee 4 Billion attack of their own on the most vulnerable and poorest people in the country, this country has not only lost all sense of irony but of decency, morals, truth, honour, the list goes on and on now. This United Kingdom surely is now a disgusting sesspit of hate in some parts, more than it’s ever been before.

All of these stories got me thinking about the next independence referendum and what happens if it’s another NO vote. Is there any forgiving another NO vote? There were reasons the last time, well lies and threats masquerading as reasons, to vote NO the last time, but there is no hiding place this time is there. Enough people know they were lied to the last time, enough people should know the truth by now.

As far as I am concerned the United Kingdom is descending into a right wing nightmare that shows no sign of abating anytime soon. Scotland will have to make a decision, the most important decision we will ever make in our lifetimes. We get another chance, irrespective of what Theresa May says or Governor General Mundell say, to take our futures and those of our children into our own hands and the answer has to be YES.

To any older readers who might come across this by accident, the next time don’t think about yourself, or the pension you think you will get, think about the children and young people in your families and in your communities, we have a chance to leave them something better, something decent, something inclusive, something to hope for. A no vote the next time is a vote for never ending Tory rule and never ending darkness. I have said it before, England is on a journey that we cannot and must not follow, we can’t save them but we can save ourselves.

With the United Kingdom becoming something even more horrible every day, and I know it’s not all people down South or in other parts of the UK, I also know that given how I feel right now there might be no forgiving another no vote for myself, we know the truth, we see the injustice, and the hate in the UK every day, and too many people are victims of it, we have got to make a different choice, we only get one more chance. Think about it, seriously, think about your decision very very carefully.



  1. trispw

    I fear for the UK.

    Brexit seems to have set it on a course for hard right wing nuttery.

    Mrs May is to be friends with the least desirable people. Trump, Erdogan, Netanyahu and Salman, where you’d have hoped that she might have made friends with people like Merkel, Hollande, the Scandinavian leaders… At least that is the kind of people we would expect to see Scotland make friends with.

    As I said, I blame the fascist press for the violence that has erupted in England against Europeans, asylum seekers and any other foreigner. Some of the stupid public actually believed that all foreigners would disappear overnight after the referendum, you know.

    Of course, if they had the place would fall to pieces.

    I can see more violence in the future as more and more the brexteers are forced to admit that what they promised was a crock of dust.

    There’s no money for the NHS. The £350m a week was a joke…a cruel one given the state of the health service in England.

    There’s going to be less money for farmers so either prices will go up or farmers will go out of business, leaving big Agri companies to take over (with all that means for standards) or the farms will go out of business and we’ll have to import food from New Zealand.

    There will not be enough money for social projects which were funded by EU money. Nor for infrastructure projects, which will hit particularly NI and Wales.

    If the Europeans leave for a better life in their own countries, being sick of being insulted by little Brits, then the health service and social services will fall to pieces. So will agriculture and the tourist and catering trade.

    All the things that they blamed on foreigners are still going to be there. Even where there are no foreigners.

    And wait for the price rises; how much your holiday will cost; insurance; what happens if you get sick? Even how much your flight will cost.

    And then what about the trade deals. What about standards? They seem happy to brag about getting blue passports (although given that that is a French word they may have to change it to blue “cross doors/gates”). They seem to want everyone to have to learn the fiendishly complete imperial measures; Ok, but there won’t be many teachers who know them well enough to teach them something that no one else uses. Still in their isolated little world, who needs to know what foreigners know.

    But what about the great British lightbulb that only lasts a month and costs four times as much to run? Or the lead paint on the toys, or the genetically modified bread or oranges… and on and on.

    A sensible government could ahve made something of Brexit. Norwegian model, Icelandic model.

    These tossers, beholden to a pile of far right nut jobs, have made an **** of it.

    Hell mend them.

    • Anonymous


      I agree with a lot of what you say. I totally regret what my leave vote has become now. I think the right wing press are partly to blame for what is happening now, as are successive Westminster governments who left the north of England to rot in it’s own mess. Thatcher closed the mines and other industries in the north, sold off the family silver, wasted the pure luck that was oil and had no plan in place. She wanted to fund unemployment and London rather than modernise and create alternatives in the north. That has created a ground swell of hate and frustration in many older people and a total lack of hope and aspiration in their children, the press have just used it to their own advantage. Labour are as much to blame in many ways, they decided that they couldn’t win just with the dirty unwashed vote so went for the middle and upper classes, giving up every principle they ever held. Yeah things improved like the NHS, and some people’s income, but they were too stupid and full of themselves to have a plan b when things went wrong and they built a lot of it around debt banking on the deregulated banks to keep it coming. Don’t even get me started on the waste that was Iraq.

      I think brexit is still too early to call in many ways, there is a lot of anger around but things will settle down at some point. I think the EU makes a rod for it’s own back if it comes down too hard. I understand the message that some want to convey that the UK must suffer to put off any other countries from doing the same, that is a risky thing to do. Voters in other countries won’t like that in some cases, esp in places like Greece and some of the eastern European countries that while being in the EU don’t feel that they have really benefitted at the lowest levels. The EU will push for closer integration I suspect, it will either happen or it will be it’s downfall, closer integration of course will put off many Scots from the process and for my own point of view think we have to be independent for a while before we think about full EU membership, if we vote for independence that is, EFTA would be my preferred option and see how it goes.

      The biggest problem in the million problems we have though is the Tories and how crap they actually are, they would never have been elected 20 years ago, it shows how far our politics have fallen that anyone would consider this shower of shit competent in any shape or form. No it will be a total cluster f and it will be down to the stupidity of the Tories and too many voters in England who will continue to vote for them.

      What a sad state of affairs and anyone considering a no vote in future will certainly not get any sympathy from me.

      Thanks for commenting.


  2. Brian

    Older person!!! How dare you young man. I am 69 and have spent years preaching the doctrine of independence to my family – children and grandchildren. Some pushback but not much.
    The only place in the world where a chunk of people prefer being governed by another country.

    • Anonymous

      No offence intended, my parents were the same when I was growing up. The shifted from Labour after Kinnock came in, they didn’t believe in Labour after that, and moved over to the SNP and Gordon Wilson, although my Dad never really trusted him to be fair. From many no voters I know it really is about fear, there are of course Brit Nats but I find that to be less so now. People are afraid to take the chance and I understand that, I just believe that the alternative is worse and always has been. Why would a country not want to govern itself as you imply.

      Thanks for reading the blog and commenting.


      • Brian

        Bruce – none taken. I’m sure you knew I had my tongue in my cheek. And yes, I agree, it make take something unpredictable to swing it totally in YES favour. I’m confident Brexit negotiations will throw up a defining moment for a new Indyref.
        And to paraphrase the BCR – Keep on blogging.

        • grumpyscottishman


          Never thought of Brexit throwing up something unexpected, be interesting to see how it goes I’m a warped sense of self flagellation of the kind Tories seem to pay money for.

          Thanks for commenting


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